Windows 11 is getting out of hand with its push for advertisments, frankly - remember the recent full-screen pop-up to persuade users to install Edge or other Microsoft services? Then another advertisment was placed in the Start menu, and now Microsoft has finally worn my temper thin - with a new Game Pass ad coming to the Settings app.
This will likely arrive in the July update for Windows 11, or at least it’s almost certain to do so. It was present in the latest preview update Microsoft just released for the OS (and quickly paused due to a bug, but that’s another story). It’s also worth noting that the ad has been present in earlier test versions of Windows 11.
Should I point out the irony of this complaint being posted on a site with ads every other sentence and doesn’t even show what the windows ads looks like?
It’s a valid complaint and all I just laughed as I scrolled past all the blank “ad here” blocks to read the article.
It is bullshit, and people will complain while continuing to use Windows so why should Microsoft care?
The thing is that they still hold an iron grip on most creative users as all their software doesn’t yet work on Linux. So we are left with little to no choice between enduring windows and Linux fanatics screaming “Just find an alternative software and relearn everything you’ve spent years learning and perfecting in your preferred one”
Do those programs not work on WINE?
Lemmy folk forgetting that not every person cares enough to switch OSes.
If you ever work tech support even at a basic level, you’ll see. It’s not even boomers or genZ. I helped a grown ass human who was my age at 40yo how to install a Firefox extension.
Can y’all IT people please stop with the condescending “you don’t know how stupid people are about computers”, it seems like there is always one of you showing up in a comment thread to tell us that we can’t have the future literally all of us want including you all as well… because WE are too stupid and lazy about computers.
I helped a grown ass human who was my age at 40yo how to install a Firefox extension.
Were you as condescending to them in person as you are being in referencing them right now? Why is not knowing how to install a Firefox extension some indicator of foreclosure on the possibility of that person becoming computer literate along whatever metrics you define? There are plenty of smart people out there who can learn how to use a computer for very complex tasks who have just simply never learned about extensions for Firefox. This is a very feasible and normal reality.
Do you know how to change the oil on your car yourself? Do simple plumbing jobs? Could you run a classroom of middle schoolers and keep them all focused while keeping your eye on the shy sad kid in the back who tends to disappear if you don’t engage them? What about basic healthcare changes or cooking? What about outdoor work or basic small engine maintenance? Do you even know shit about the most basic species of trees in your backyard? Do you know the species of songbirds you often hear outside your window? Do you even pay attention to that? Do you know how to drive a dirt bike extremely fast on a rough dirt road? Do you know how to adjust for the violent explosive power of turbo lag in a car with a turbocharger so that torque oversteer doesn’t launch you off the road? Do you know how to sew and repair basic garments? To weave? Can you even fish? Like could you literally even just catch a fish to save your life right now if I handed you a fishing rod unassembled with no instructions?
My point is, don’t go looking for confirmation of how stupid or lazy people are or how limited their capacity is to evolve and grow by casting the shapes of their ignorance onto the floor and trying to read some magic language from that.
Maybe they don’t know because they are hopelesssly stupid, but maybe not? If they are intelligent and they don’t know computers then those are the perfect people to teach linux. Then it is their first language instead of windows, many linux distro are perfectly fine for this at this point.
See here is the bottom line, legions of IT people show up online always arguing they think they know that the average person is too dumb, lazy and uninterested in computers for Linux adoption to seriously take off in the personal computer market and challenge Microsoft, but y’all don’t know shit about humans. You are experts in computers who think that makes you experts in human potential.
Go take some theater classes (or get an degree in education) and get educated before you start drawing conclusions about people when you really haven’t spent time closely studying how people engage with their potential and what situations facilitate that in basic human interaction and framing of conversations (both literal and abstract).
I’m sorry if I snapped at you but I think it is existentially important to recognize here that we don’t know what people are capable of, you can’t know the essential capacity of people to change, don’t try to predict it. Focus on creating the material opportunity for change and the rest may follow depending on what people desire, no matter to us, we desire to create that positive opportunity for change because it is the right thing to do, not because we like the future growth charts of the things we believe are important and vital.
I think you’re missing the point here. It’s more that people couldn’t even be bothered to search up how to do something (that takes seconds) that they want to do first, and instead just rely on someone they think is an expert without putting in any effort at all.
Your examples don’t really make sense either as a lot of these are paid professions for larger tasks that most people simply don’t want to do. There’s a huge difference in searching online “how to install a Firefox extension” vs “how to do an weave”, etc.
End of the day, the average person doesn’t care and if they truly did they’d have the initiative to have just researched it and done it on their own.
Bringing it back to the whole thing about Linux, can you imagine how frustrating it would be to have to help debug a user’s Linux installation when they already need help with installing a browser add on? I work with tech and Linux on a daily basis and I already find it frustrating doing it for myself (fuck Nvidia drivers). No way am I gonna recommend it to someone else.
Bringing it back to the whole thing about Linux, can you imagine how frustrating it would be to have to help debug a user’s Linux installation when they already need help with installing a browser add on? I work with tech and Linux on a daily basis and I already find it frustrating doing it for myself (fuck Nvidia drivers). No way am I gonna recommend it to someone else.
Are you honestly going to still claim at this late date of 2024 that a decent popular linux distro is actually going to be MORE of a headache than Windows?
…?
Have you tried Windows recently?
I’m not sure why that is so hard to believe. I use Ubuntu and Windows at work daily and Windows at home. I know the challenges of both and Windows at worst just annoys me with them forcing the new Outlook app on me. Everything else just works. Plays games amazingly, Visual Studio is uncontested, syncs nicely with my Android phone and I have no driver issues whatsoever. Don’t have to go diving into the command line to change settings either.
The only time Linux works perfectly for me is on my Steam Deck and that’s entirely because Valve has handled all the driver issues for us on that hardware.
Outlook is atrocious what on earth are you talking about? Just trying to use it at work it is so frustrating and the UI is horrendous for everything. Truly even basic things like trying to read when a meeting actually starts just from looking at the calendar is a headache, and because all of this is proprietary unlike with Linux, tough luck, that is how things are and you can’t do shit to change it. Neither can an experienced computer user trying to help you.
I am sorry you really don’t have an accurate handle on the state of things anymore, I think you are stuck in your ways and stressed out by life and you don’t realize that emotion and lack of mental plasticity is leading to you assume everyone else is as stuck in their ways as you (including your future self when you are able to feel less overworked and stressed).
Windows is atrocious at this point, search doesn’t work and purposefully confuses new computer users about where is being searched and what is being searched. Ads pop up everywhere in the UI and will continue to spread like a terminal cancer in the UI.
Search on windows also just sucks and takes ages with the default settings (an inexperienced computer user will be using).
The file manager on windows in most marquee windows programs like word, excel etc… all open up an entirely different file manager half way through the process of saving a file in perhaps the most insane UI pattern to keep from the mess that was Windows 8 (even though I actually really liked the core idea at first).
Windows is buggy AND windows is constantly playing head games with its user by trying to force them to use the edge browser. It is very very confusing to a new computer user what the hell is even going on.
I mean, Windows illegally changed the entire operating system countless people had without getting consent because it would look good for their numbers.
Seriously you are WAYYY out of your league if you are going to claim a nice Linux distribution on good hardware with good driver support (such as some dells or thinkpads) is categorically wayyy worse than trying to use a windows laptop in 2024….
…please get your head out of the sand :)
I mean do you want to get into the massive security vulnerability at a tactical and strategic level that Microsoft’s co-pilot represents? This is endgame for business security, Windows is in a worse spot than it has been in probably a decade at least and they deserve it. IT people and corporations have to seriously wonder if Windows even cares about following the law, which makes trusting Windows for the software relied upon by their company a complex question indeed……
It used to be that Linux was better ideologically because it gave you agency over your computer, but now things have gotten so much worse that the reason is practical and no longer ideological.
I don’t think you’re talking about the Outlook I am talking about because I’m talking about the Outlook Mail and Calendar apps, not the Office ones. And that’s fine and dandy about proprietary software and all but frankly I haven’t really seen any non-proprietary mail apps that look aesthetically pleasing. But that’s besides the point, it’s a matter of personal preference when it comes to visuals after all.
You don’t have to come here and assume you know everything about me simply from my choice of OS and invalidating my experiences with personal attacks no less. If your rant here is trying to convince me or anyone else who is reading that we should abandon Windows because of the reasons, you have stated, you are failing terribly I’m afraid. Not everyone has such high standards as you have and it’s frankly patronizing for you to think that I or anyone else have not considered these options when it affects our workflow. If anything, people reading this are gonna be dissuaded of Linux because if this is the kind of tone and experience we’re going to get when we try to, well, it’s a lot less stressful staying away from Linux.
It’s somewhat concerning that you have such a strong obsession over the topic that you would go and whether intentionally or unintentionally offend people and I hope that you are a much more pleasant person to converse with outside of this topic or even this site.
I’d also like to add, nowhere did I ever mention using laptops. All my experiences are with desktops that I had a hand in building from scratch. So I’m not sure what you’re even getting at with those assumptions.
Have a good day sir.
Exactly. Look at Reddit/Lemmy where people ask questions instead of searching, when they could’ve gotten their answer faster by searching using their question as a query instead of posting it (i.e. LMGTFY). People are lazy in very weird ways, some are happier to call tech support than read an article, even if that call takes more than 2x as long as the search.
I agree with the sentiment of your post, but I think the examples are a bit too far fetched:
I’d wager most people use a computer/phone on a daily basis, which is why having a basic understanding of it seems like knowledge we should all have.
Inversely, most people don’t need even have a turbo in their car and many don’t even have a car, so any knowledge relating to that is probably useless for them.
That being said, even if someone is less knowledgeable in a field, respect should always be the baseline, as you illustrate, they’re probably skilled in something else!
I’m saying that as an IT person that’s aware that I’m making money mostly because people don’t bother to learn all this, so in the end I don’t mind that much.
Excellent rant, I hate that doomer mindset. Old people used DOS, kids figure out vpns to get on gambling sites. People aren’t stupid they just haven’t had a reason to learn, or didn’t have someone to make them care.
Awesome post. As a former IT person who has worn many other hats over the years, I couldn’t agree with you more.
Lemmy folk forgetting that not every person cares enough to switch OSes.
Right, so if they don’t care they’re not going to complain very much about it. If they are going to complain what are they going to do about it? If it’s “just complain and nothing else” then Microsoft doesn’t care.
So are you volunteering to install Linux on everyone’s machines when they get a new computer? And answer their tech support questions when they inevitably need that one program?
I’m volunteering to install Linux on my machine instead of just bitching about Microsoft while continuing to use Windows.
I don’t see how pointing out the reality of “if you’re not going to stop using Windows then Microsoft doesn’t care what you think” somehow makes me responsible for every computer in the world.
I think this community exists only to complain about Microsoft. Not sure I ever see anything else.
Wrong, this is the elon musk complaint forum. Always has been
I read the title and thought, “Oh is this another ad for Linux?”
Seems to me it’s mostly complaining about Google.
That is patently false.
…Sometimes we also complain about Facebook or Tesla.
Yeah but it is mostly warranted.
I wish we Apple-bashed more. Fuck Apple.
They do make it very hard to speak about anything else
Thing is, most of these complaints are serious non issues.
You’re being slowly boiled alive, frog friend
I’ve managed to de-google completely and mostly de-microsoft, but I use cloud streaming (shadow) for gaming and anything else that’s more than my shitty laptop can’t handle and there’s no way to use Linux on the cloud part. Only thing I can’t do anything about yet, and doubt that’ll change anytime soon or at all.
Win11 becomes a less and less appealing switch day by day… When I can no longer hold into Win10, I think I’ll just have to jump ship to Linux.
Win10 is already quite privacy poor, but Win11 is straight up intolerable.
My machine cannot run 11 because of the arbitrary hardware requirements so I was looking down the barrel of Win10 being no longer supported next year.
I proactively installed Linux Mint on a second SSD I had kicking around just to see if I could live with it without making any commitments. I never looked back since then. I switched to OpenSUSE soon after though but that was because I wanted something that ran the KDE Plasma 6 desktop environment because I didn’t like how Cinnamon was handling multiple monitors. But I haven’t booted up my Windows 10 drive since then, other than to migrate some files I needed.
Solution is easy - just don’t use windows
Microsoft went too far in 2001 when they included a new online activation feature in Windows XP which spearheaded the future of drm and enshitification. All the most recent stuff is just more icing on the shit cake. They’ve been one-upping themselves ever since.
Stallman warned us, we didn’t listen.
I’m glad to see BadVista still up https://badvista.fsf.org/blog/view/?set_language=en
I’d say that the ‘modern’ era of Microsoft Enshittification started with IE4 as well as Windows 98. The Channel bar put ads on the Windows 95 & 98 desktops. It was easily disabled, but even that far back, Microsoft was starting to work on making their stuff suck just that much more.
Next was Windows ME blocking DOS access, while still running on DOS, making the OS a bit … unstable, followed by your point of Software Activation in XP.
Windows 2000 was amazing, though. Something really inspiring belief in good corporations and bright capitalist future. LOL
I liked Win2K, yes - then Linux :)
Great shit analogy, Bo Bandi.
Thanks, Mr.Layhe
Agreed, XP was the turning point - I decided I will never let such an intrusive software on my private computers, so I switched from Win2k to Linux.
People think I’m nuts when I say Win2k was my favorite Windows. I switched to Linux before Vista came out. People say WinXP was good, but really, it was just tolerable.
High five, brother :) I think the XP crowd was just the generation of “one step more tolerant towards privacy intrusions” / not quite computer knowledgeable enough to understand the implications of letting your operating system phone home. In terms of user interface, it was indeed tolerable - you could still configure it to look and behave like Win2K mostly, which is what I had to do for work for quite a long time.
Compared to Win2k, it would just be a resource-hog. :/
The thing that irks me the most is that those things work. They’ll see a little complain from the most vocal ones, and that’s it. The revenue will increase, their shareholders will be pleased, the OS will be worse, and we’ll have no viable alternative.
Unless governments start to regulate the hell out of tech companies, it’s only downhill from there.
Regarding Linux, what commercial software are you dependent on? More and more, it’s all online, even Office.
- Adobe Creative Suite. They will probably never release a Linux version
- Industry standard music production s/w
- Offbeat collection of educational/research s/w, creators of which don’t know that Linux exists. They sometimes don’t even support MacOS
- Office Suite which is compatible with MS Office shenanigans
You’re correct on all counts, but you’re also not a typical desktop user, you’re definitely a professional or power user with specific needs.
The average user needs the ability to use a web browser and that’s honestly about it. That’s why Chromebooks are so popular with schools. A basic Linux desktop is quite capable for a standard user.
For the things yoi need you’re correct that it’s not 1:1 and you’d need to move to open source alternatives or tinker with VMs/WINE to get those apps working and it would be a chore.
Adobe Creative Cloud, which despite the name is pretty much local. And although Microsoft Office works online, it has a series of issues that the desktop version doesn’t have, like broken formatting on Word.
Ah. Yeah, I don’t know of a way to get ACC on Linux.
Autodesk for myself, apparently its super dependant on .net and other windows framework so its not like they are going to make it linux compatible any time soon.
It looks like it runs perfectly via WINE from a few quick Google searches
Agree with everything expect for the viable alternative. Linux is viable for many people
Why wont we have viable alternative ? We already have
I got the “It’s time to upgrade to Windows 11” message on my Windows 10 laptop. It’s getting aggravating.
You guys complain but you never actually switch to Linux. :)
If you truly cared about being a technological slave, you would learn Linux tomorrow. But just like someone stuck in a abusive relationship, you hang around despite the horrible treatment because you are afraid to leave what’s comfortable.
Everyone in this thread is already using Linux and just using this thread to circlejerk about issues the average Windows user won’t care about.
I know ExplorePatcher and Startallback can stop ads on Start menu. is there any viable solution for this Settings app ad?
Microsoft already knows that people keep windows around either because they want multiplayer games or are scared of linux.
Or random application availability and/or ease of use.
Two cases in point:
- Photo Mechanic. It makes it really easy/fast to sort through tons of photos. There are some Linux compatible alternatives, but they’re just not as good
- Fusion 360. There are a couple of things you can do to make it work, but since Linux isn’t officially supported the install process can be a bit fiddily and there’s no guarantee that an update won’t break things.
Things are certainly better now than they have been in the past, but if you’re somewhat time limited (eg your computer is more of a tool than a thing to spend time tweaking) Linux can still be a bit offputting - especially if some of the core applications you use aren’t officially supported.
What’s next Microsoft? Replace the windows os loading windows page with a 30s ad? Or have defender uninstall apps if a competitor pays enough? Maybe capture a screenshot of my screen every 3 seconds for AI analysis?
Maybe capture a screenshot of my screen every 3 seconds for AI analysis?
Yep yep. Was hoping someone would call me out on that. 😝
Come on man, stop giving them good ideas!
Nah. I’ve been advocating for Linux for decades. For decades I’ve been trying to convince people to switch on its own merits, but none of that has been effective.
It took Microsoft sabotaging their product for me to see the needle shift. So I’m done trying to convince people with carrots, it’s time for Microsoft to convince the masses with sticks.
Yeah I think the masses are going to be a tough sell on Linux until computer manufacturers start offering Linux builds with a pre-installed instance.
I’m sure there are places that do it but there’s probably money to be made in just setting up Linux on machines for people.
You can get laptops on Amazon now with Ubuntu pre-installed. :)
Yeah I think the masses are going to be a tough sell on Linux until computer manufacturers start offering Linux builds with a pre-installed instance.
Everyone’s family needs a tech geek to install Linux on a brand new computer.
I know that this expression desensitises people to something serious, but it describes Microsoft - the “it”/corporation - perfectly: rapist mentality. It shows how eager Microsoft is to disregard consent, users saying “no, I don’t want it”, and to forge itself over the users as long as it gets some benefit out of it.
Including new obnoxious advertisement slots into an already released product - one that you paid for - is only a result of that mentality.
I hope they don’t show an ad on my doctor’s operating table computer while he’s performing surgery on my heart and watching through a camera image. 😱
Meanwhile I would pray they would while I am so my family can get that good money lol
